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By a Newsnet reporter
 
Scottish Labour has been challenged to reveal the full breakdown of votes cast in the party’s leadership contest as concerns were raised that people were allowed to cast multiple votes.
 
The SNP has called on the Labour party to make public, details of the latest contest results after similar concerns were raised following the 2008 election of Iain Gray.

Labour’s electoral system makes it possible for an individual to cast multiple votes in a single contest.  Reports have suggested that one candidate in the race to succeed outgoing leader Iain Gray has received seven votes from one person.

The SNP has also called on Labour to confirm whether members of Labour social drinking clubs were allowed to vote.

The SNP’s Business Convener Derek MacKay said

“After the disastrous effect of Labour’s crazy election system on the UK leadership contest leaving them with a leader who lacked the support of his MPs it is vital Scottish Labour are utterly transparent over the leadership result.

“There must be absolute clarity over who has voted and how many times.

“With a falling membership of 13,000 it would be no surprise if Labour sought to hide the figures as they did in 2008 or bump up the numbers with members of local social clubs and it’s no surprise they are encouraging people to vote early and vote often.”

Members of Labour social clubs are described as ‘affiliate’ members of the Labour party and their numbers have been known to be used in the past in order to ‘swell’ Labour’s numbers in Scotland.

The UK wide election that saw Ed Miliband triumph over brother David revealed that Labour’s membership in Scotland had shrunk to 13,135. 

Mr Mackay added:

“It is ridiculous that one person can have their vote counted seven times.  Without a full breakdown of the results there will be real questions over the credibility of the new leader.”

Today’s result is expected to reveal that Johann Lamont has triumphed in her bid to replace Iain Gray as the next leader of Scottish Labour.

Ms Lamont emerged the clear favourite after winning the support of the powerful trade union vote.

If victorious, Ms Lamont faces immediate questions over her views on the Clyde based Trident nuclear weapons system after it emerged she had repeatedly refused to respond to questions posed by anti-nuclear weapons group Scottish CND.

The current Deputy Scottish Labour leader will also be hoping to avoid a repeat of the serious gaffe that saw her attack the Scottish government’s record on rape by citing details of a court case that turned out to have been fabricated.

 

Related story - http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-news/3435-scottish-labours-deputy-leader-a-scottish-newspaper-and-the-fabricated-rape-case

Comments  

 
# curley bill 2011-12-17 01:04
'Mr Mackay added:

“It is ridiculous that one person can have their vote counted seven times.'

It's worser than that. When candidates were being selected for the 2007 election a popular local man was banjoed in favour of union apparatchik Richard Leonard (who crashed and burned spectacularly). I asked a local Lab councillor why the local man hadn't been selected and she said, "It's how the votes went."
What she didn't tell me was that the local Lab MP's 1 vote was worth 680 ordinary members votes - now that's the sign of a real democratic party.

Abusive comment on the basis of a person’s physical appearance removed. – NNS Mod Team
 
 
# Jediirnbru 2011-12-17 14:09
1 vote was worth 680

All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.
 
 
# mudfries 2011-12-17 16:06
I've not had time to read this article but will be back later on for a look, I dont know what its about but anything with a picture of Daphne out of The Broons must be worth a read.
 
 
# Mark MacLachlan 2011-12-17 19:21
Ms Lamont has arrived.

twitpic.com/7ul3bg
 
 
# rhymer 2011-12-17 16:18
[quote name="curley bill"]'Mr Mackay added: “It is ridiculous that one person can have their vote counted seven times.'

Ah well, it is the labour party.
Like Animal Farm
- some are more equal than others
 
 
# Any_Justice 2011-12-17 02:08
As a member of unite (and although opted out) I was sent a ballot paper endorsing lamont and davidson, which I binned. I imagine it is perfectly possible for multiple votes in the contest.
 
 
# DavieB 2011-12-17 02:10
This is the sort of vote fixing that needs total scrutiny.
I would hate to see postal voting scams come the time of the Independence referendum.

So its goodbye to Gray. My final word to him is:
Take a bucket of water,
Put your hand in it, up to your wrist
Take it out, and the hole that youve left there,
Is a measure of how much you'll be missed.
 
 
# nchanter 2011-12-17 12:09
Quoting DavieB:
This is the sort of vote fixing that needs total scrutiny.
I would hate to see postal voting scams come the time of the Independence referendum.

So its goodbye to Gray. My final word to him is:
Take a bucket of water,
Put your hand in it, up to your wrist
Take it out, and the hole that youve left there,
Is a measure of how much you'll be missed.

An oldie but a goodie
 
 
# rgweir 2011-12-17 17:54
My late grandfather told me this DavieB,Very wise words.
 
 
# ThatsNotMyName 2011-12-17 02:53
It doesn't matter how many votes they have. An incompetent fool will be elected!
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 07:29
I don't think anyone will be overly worried about Johann Lamont as Labour Group leader in Scotland. Not to be too unkind, the lady is about as electable to the post of First Minister as a stone and the stone has the added benefit of being unable to lie or make up imaginary rape cases.

The real poison pill will be the deputy. If in fact Davidson is the deputy in waiting, it will be with one purpose in mind only... to start rammies at every opportunity. He is a mixer and Labour party equivalent of a shock trooper. His job will be to start fights and arguments at every opportunity, draw SNP MSPs into fights and squabbles at every opening presented. If at the same time he can also bring Holyrood into disrepute or present it as a Mickey Mouse parliament to the general public, he will!

This Westminster creature will not hesitate to do his very best to crush any and all attempts at reasoned debate on the constitution. I would go as far as to say that Johann Lamont will not in fact be the actual Leader of Labour Group North Britain, Davidson following direct orders from London will!
 
 
# Marga B 2011-12-17 10:40
Macart, I don't think we can be happy about the further degradation of the Scottish parliament.
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 10:47
This is my fear Marga. Westminster will use any means to demean Holyrood as an entity and Davidson is the ideal tool for the job. He takes his orders from London. We are led to believe that the Labour MSPs have some regard for Holyrood, its even been touted that some of them have some sympathy for both independence and FFA, but with Lamont and Davidson in the big seat and with the backing of the MSM, they are in the perfect position to do some damage regardless of their fellow MSPs. Not, I hasten to add to the independence cause per se but to Holyrood itself.
 
 
# curley bill 2011-12-17 13:30
'Davidson is the ideal tool'

Never has a more accurate comment been posted.
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 15:38
Ye caught that, did ye? Purely innocent I assure you! :0D
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 18:10
innocent! mmmmmm!
 
 
# nchanter 2011-12-17 12:10
Quoting Macart:
I don't think anyone will be overly worried about Johann Lamont as Labour Group leader in Scotland. Not to be too unkind, the lady is about as electable to the post of First Minister as a stone and the stone has the added benefit of being unable to lie or make up imaginary rape cases.

The real poison pill will be the deputy. If in fact Davidson is the deputy in waiting, it will be with one purpose in mind only... to start rammies at every opportunity. He is a mixer and Labour party equivalent of a shock trooper. His job will be to start fights and arguments at every opportunity, draw SNP MSPs into fights and squabbles at every opening presented. If at the same time he can also bring Holyrood into disrepute or present it as a Mickey Mouse parliament to the general public, he will!

This Westminster creature will not hesitate to do his very best to crush any and all attempts at reasoned debate on the constitution. I would go as far as to say that Johann Lamont will not in fact be the actual Leader of Labour Group North Britain, Davidson following direct orders from London will!

Davidson, a berserker in waiting
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 13:18
Ahm tellin' ye, watch this space! If he is the deputy leader he'll start a rammie on day 1 in Holyrood.
 
 
# Exile 2011-12-17 21:25
But how can he be in Holyrood? He's not an MSP. Surely they can't be hoping to parachute him in? There's no seats they can be sure of winning in a by-election. Or is there? Have I missed something?
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 22:21
Naw Exile, false alarm! The bruiser didnae even get a nod as deputy. :0D
 
 
# Drew1314 2011-12-17 08:45
Labour - the party of democracy.

Now that is an offensive joke to many hard-working and unemployed souls throughout Scotland

Will they be transparent - never. Therein lies Labour's problems.
 
 
# gus1940 2011-12-17 09:33
Remember Glenrothes - that must never be allowed to happen again.
 
 
# Briggs 2011-12-17 09:47
I really don't see what business it is of anybodys how Labour in Scotland elect their leader.

However it occurs , a smoke filled room full of shadowy men, or a smoke filled room full of shadowy men with multiple votes, it should make no difference to their opponents.

Maybe they should draw straws.
 
 
# Fungus 2011-12-17 10:27
Quoting Briggs:
I really don't see what business it is of anybodys how Labour in Scotland elect their leader.


This party is seeking to be the elected government of a one person/one vote democracy. If they cannot understand that concept of democracy as it relates to the leadership of their party then what confidence does that give that they will understand it when it applies to public elections for MSPs? There have been allegations that Labour Party vote rigging has taken place in Scottish elections, most notably in the UK government election in Glenrothes and prosecutions in England for postal vote rigging.

This is why it is everyone's business. If the party is run undemocraticall y then chances are the temptation will be there to run the country in the same way for the benefit of the ruling clique and their acolytes. Public scrutiny is the only cure for this malaise.
 
 
# Marga B 2011-12-17 10:48
Fungus, totally agree. I'd say it's gone long past "the temptation".
 
 
# Briggs 2011-12-17 10:59
I started of my Post with the firm intention of saying it was none of our business how Labour elect a leader and half way through turned it into a bit of whimsy.

Really it is no business of ours and nor should we intrude into someone's private grief.

Really I don't give a toss what they do and frankly neither should you.
 
 
# mealer 2011-12-17 09:56
Briggs,
I concur.
 
 
# Louperdowg 2011-12-17 10:30
A spokesman for Joe McGlumpher said,

"Joe sadly passed away in 1995, but he would be delighted to know that his vote will be going to Johann".
 
 
# Ken500 2011-12-17 10:40
Corrupt elections in the UK. Never
 
 
# thomsor 2011-12-17 10:46
Very true Fungus, Mind you Labour are not keen of openness as we are still waiting to find out about the meetings they had with News International prior to the hacking scandal. Democracy and Labour are strangers.
 
 
# UpSpake 2011-12-17 11:02
How long after the new leader is announced before the ballot papers mysteriously disappear ?.
Labour Party - Trust ?. Don't think so !.
 
 
# drumsmudden 2011-12-17 11:37
aa widnae lippen on them tae rin a menage

PS hoo dae ye pit the wee stroke abin a letter?
 
 
# hiorta 2011-12-17 18:10
Quoting drumsmudden:
PS hoo dae ye pit the wee stroke abin a letter?


Like this, ye mean? menáge?
Haud doon 'Alt Gr' while ye press the vowel
 
 
# west_lothian_questioner 2011-12-17 11:45
If these suggestions are true (and let's be honest... we are all well prepared to believe they are)this is yet another sad day for the democratic processes in Scotland. SLAB have seemingly failed to grasp the nettle and clean up their act behind the scenes, so what hope is there that they will clean it up any in the chamber at Holyrood?

They are supposed to be providing opposition to the SNP government, but their record on doing this only ever shows up in the votes they cast or, sometimes, fail to cast. The role of opposition has to be a bit more rounded than that. They offer nothing other than automatic nay-saying. No policy alternatives worth a light, no credible support for any measure they might agree with, nothing at all other than bluster, bile and spite. That is not what a parliamentary democracy requires of its opposition parties, and SLAB, being the largest of those by a long way, should be providing some kind of leading light in that. Their repeated failure to do so, coupled with what appears to be a possibly flawed and undemocratic election process can only leave them stuck firmly in the mire and leaves Scotland and our parliament poorer for the absence of some form of credible alternative voice. Shame on them. Hell mend them for their intransigence and blind stupidity.
 
 
# FREEDOM1 2011-12-17 16:25
The problem is West Lothian that what is left of SLAB are NOT capable of being an opposition. They claim they are a party of the people. After fifty years in power they have not helped the poor people they are supposed to help.I don,t want to be nasty but all they seem to do at FM questions is desk slapping. No decent policies, nothing positive. The people who voted for them must see this, or maybe they don,t watch FM questions. I am at a loss as to why they voted for some of these people, especially kelly??
 
 
# sneckedagain 2011-12-17 12:11
This election has been likened to "electing the captain for the Titanic" and I can think of a no more apt description of it.

Until recently my wife, an SNP member since the 1960s, routinely had a vote in Labour elections because she was in a trade union.

However I think it does the SNP and its prospects no good whatsover to hurl invective, humourous or otherwise, at whoever wins this contest.
No matter who prevails they are sitting on an island as the waters rise around them. They are where they choose to be and history will wash them away.
 
 
# cokynutjoe 2011-12-17 12:15
As they used to say in Ulster elections, "Vote Early & Vote Often!"
 
 
# Ken500 2011-12-17 12:53
Cokynutjoe


Ha Ha
 
 
# James01 2011-12-17 12:56
I watched a report on the leadership contest this morning on News 24, the Scottish reporter stated that the new leader's main job would be to "save the UK". Surely this is very emmotive and wholly innapropriate language for a supposably unbiased organisation. A more appropriate way of phrasing it would be "to stop Scotland leaving the UK" or "keep Scotland in the UK". As far as I'm aware the UK would still exist even if Scotland left so Scots would not be voting to "save the UK".
 
 
# Grenscot 2011-12-17 14:31
Quoting James01:
As far as I'm aware the UK would still exist even if Scotland left so Scots would not be voting to "save the UK".


James the United Kingdom of Great Britain came into being with the union of the Scottish and English Parliaments in 1707.Since these are the only two Kingdoms that make up the present UK, if Scotland leaves then there will only be one Kingdom which can scarcely be united with itself
 
 
# Exile 2011-12-17 21:31
Fair enough, grenscot, but the parliaments weren't united, the kingdoms were. The Scottish parliament was adjourned. It was reconvened in 1999. Now, to become a fully fledged modern parliament, it just needs to re disunite the kingdoms. But your main point is fair enough. Once independence is achieved, the UK will be no more.
 
 
# Ken500 2011-12-17 13:13
Johanna the patsy

At least she recognised the Scottish Bill took even more money out of Scotland to the UK Treasury.
 
 
# scottish_skier 2011-12-17 13:20
And Lamont it is..... hardly a surprise.

Don't really know what to make of this. I can't see her 'saving' SLAB. All I see is their further, steady decline.
 
 
# UpSpake 2011-12-17 13:22
Well, here she is the new leader of Labour in Scotland the venerable Joanne with her new deputy Mr Sarwas. What a dynamic duo, cuttinng edge wit, powerful duo amply capable of seeing off the past and offering opportunity for some. Question now is, who are the some ?.
 
 
# Saporian 2011-12-17 13:23
And Anas Sarwar as deputy leader! bbc.co.uk/.../...
 
 
# thomsor 2011-12-17 13:23
Breaking News - SNP and Alex Salmond are breaking out the bubbly.
 
 
# Jim Johnston 2011-12-17 13:31
Congratulation Johann,
I hope you get a big box of gum shields for Xmas. They'll be very handy for FMQ's.

[Offensive language removed. – NNS Mod Team ]
 
 
# robbie 2011-12-17 14:20
Naw , she needs room to get her foot in her mouth.
 
 
# GrassyKnollington 2011-12-17 13:34
Well hark and rejoice.

Labour Scottish region rise phoenix like from the ashes. Their new leader mistress of all she surveys (except the Scottish MP's who don't intend to take orders from a mere branch leader thanks very much)

A new Scotland founded on opposing everything the b*st*rt SNP propose is born. Ring the bells.

*Slapped on head by moderator*
 
 
# pa_broon74 2011-12-17 13:55
I don't wish to be cruel but, Johann Lamont is basically a female version of Ian Grey.

To say she seems quite pedestrian is to do down pedestrians.

I know FMQ's aren't the be all and end all but even in interviews she's not exactly inspirational having as she does all the gravitas of damp cardboard box.

Labour really are doomed in Scotland.
 
 
# GrassyKnollington 2011-12-17 14:05
I was scandalised to see her likened to Angela Merkel's East German cousin recently.

Categorically not the kind of juvenile nonsense you'd hear me repeating.
 
 
# Stevie Cosmic 2011-12-17 14:37
'LOL' isn't quite as descriptive enough.

:)
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 18:18
pa_broon74

"I don't wish to be cruel but, Johann Lamont is basically a female version of Ian Grey."



Johann is now in charge of the whole party in Scotland - MP's/MSP's. Is it just me or do others think that the MP's will just ignore her completely (like the rest of us)

offensive comment based on personal appearance removed - NNS Mod Team
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 21:34
That's my first edit! I didn't think it was offensive?
My apologies!
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 13:34
Well who'da thunk it, Anas Sarwar! I thought that Davidson would have been a sure win there. Still as thomsor posts, break oot the bubbly. :0)
 
 
# Wee-Scamp 2011-12-17 13:36
Two Glasgow MSPs running Labour's Scottish branch.. Hmmm. I wonder what the rest of Labour's tribe thinks of that?
 
 
# Islegard 2011-12-17 13:39
They don't think! They do as they're told.
 
 
# Early Ball 2011-12-17 13:39
Anas Sarwar is a 28 year old MP according to wikipedia
 
 
# Islegard 2011-12-17 13:46
Milliband Placeman?
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 18:22
puppet master!
milliband (hand) - Sarwar (string)- Lamont (puppet)

I was going to go with a glove puppet but the mental picture was to painful!
 
 
# Suomi 2011-12-17 13:54
Lamont is the new labour leader in Scotland.Quite frankly I find it astonishing that they chose someone who seems to lack all of the qualities you would expect in a political leader.
 
 
# Electric Hermit 2011-12-17 14:40
Quoting Suomi:
Quite frankly I find it astonishing that they chose someone who seems to lack all of the qualities you would expect in a political leader.


Why be astonished? Look at Lamont's predecessor.

The last thing the British Labour & Unionist Party wants is someone with leadership qualities who might stir up the natives in the provinces and make Milliwho look like even more of a nonentity.
 
 
# hektorsmum 2011-12-17 17:33
Someone really should tell them that all Johann Lamont, I suppose she will be La-mont now, is only the leader of the Labour Group in the Scottish Parliament. No wonder these people get ideas very much beyond their station.
I too congratulate her and thank any all mighty around for her. She is as boring as get out as a speaker, had far too much of her when they were counting the ballot papers in May. Now I have to stomach her every Thursday, note to self must not listen to FMQ's or foot will go through the TV.
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 18:23
I'm astonished but NOT surprised!
 
 
# west_lothian_questioner 2011-12-17 18:30
It's no like they had a lot of choice .... sad or what?
 
 
# Arraniki 2011-12-17 14:04
So how many deputes does Labour have in Scotland?

Sarwar is an MP so we will not see him in Holyrood pending a by-election.

So who stands in for Jo-Jo when she is affski somewhere?
 
 
# Early Ball 2011-12-17 14:09
Please be Mr. Kelly
 
 
# Arbroath1320 2011-12-17 14:28
Ian Grey?

I hear he's awfy good at "attacking" the SNP. :D
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 17:58
CLEAR!!!! Nurse, plug us intae the national grid. Oh he's asleep ye say!

He thought he wiz retired. :0D
 
 
# Arraniki 2011-12-17 14:14
Just spilled my coffee, Early Ball!
 
 
# rhymer 2011-12-17 14:15
A Westminister MP as deputy leader of the Scottish labour party at Holyrood ?
I think it is rather obvious that Sarwar is her minder and a direct link to her boss at London labour HQ
 
 
# call me dave 2011-12-17 19:28
Quoting rhymer:
A Westminister MP as deputy leader of the Scottish labour party at Holyrood ?
I think it is rather obvious that Sarwar is her minder and a direct link to her boss at London labour HQ

----------------------------------------
You ;Islegard etal have got it in one!

The Curren bun will be the enforcer locally no doubt.

Ms lamont will be too busy picking out her fashion statement for Thursday next (holidays excepted) rather than pencilling in some popular new policies for the likes of us to read over.

I wonder what her starting question will be.

Guess?

Will the FM agree with me that the referendum should be held immediately as Scotland is in turmoil due to the uncertainty.
 
 
# GrassyKnollington 2011-12-17 14:28
I've just read an article on the BBC website about Iain Gray by Andrew Black.

He writes

Quote:
A party review has now concluded the new Scottish Labour leader will get those powers, with the new fully devolved leader now able to effectively distance the party north of the border from Westminster.


The intriguing part is that having read the article twice I have no idea what Black means.

Which powers will the new leader get? I suspect Lamont will still have no authority over Labour MP's and will continue to have authority only over her MSP's.

I assume the mythical "new powers" are not defined because no one has agreed what they will be. I expect that if they keep telling us they exist, like "the Scottish Labour Party" they will become real in the minds of all unquestioning believers like the BBC.

bbc.co.uk/.../...
 
 
# rhymer 2011-12-17 14:48
[quote name="GrassyKnollingt on"]I've just read an article on the BBC website about Iain Gray by Andrew Black .quote]
I read thatpiece too and have asked the BBC/A. Black to let us all know what these "new powers" are.

I think the odds of me getting a straight answer are on par with
J.Lamont getting any "new powers"?
 
 
# Cairn 2011-12-17 14:36
Poll in the Scotsman

Will Scottish Labour’s new leader pull back the SNP’s lead in the polls?

Results

Yes
2074 (65%)

No
1097 (35%)

scotsman.com/.../...
 
 
# Wee-Scamp 2011-12-17 14:40
Personally I don't think she'll have any impact whatsoever.
 
 
# DavieB 2011-12-17 15:14
Grassy...I voted yesterday at 4.36 and the poll was at yes 14% and no at 86%..Must have been the postal votes that sent it so high so quickly.
What do you call people who deliberatly alter polls to suit themselves. (and dont all say the labour party lol)
 
 
# Wee-Scamp 2011-12-17 14:43
Not sure if I heard it absolutely correctly but the BBC bloke commenting on Rosa's acceptance speech said she'd talked about devolution not being the starting point (presumably to independence) but the arrival point.

In other words it seems the status quo is pretty much the limit of her aspiration and vision.
 
 
# HoratiosLobby 2011-12-17 14:57
A (very) small group of SLAB people chittering outside Morningside Post Office awaiting the arrival of Ms Lamont and Deputy Sarwar for their first meet and greet at 2pm
 
 
# call me dave 2011-12-17 14:58
Well it's Lamont who was left with the 'old maid card' after all the shuffling in the labour pack.

Don't envy her the job of trying to buff up the labour image in Scotland. A lick of paint on a rotten core wont fool the people anymore labour have, in general, been sussed only the die-hards and the frightened will cling on to the end.

Less than 20 weeks to the elections in May it's nigh impossible to see any turn round in fortunes for labour and remember, like share prices, they can go further down in the polls as well as up.

She got 51% of the vote apparently. How many people actually voted (300,000) compared to those who were entitled to vote (??) but that's democracy for you.


Ms Lamont get your boots on and get on the park it's been a while since the SNP were given a close game! Aye right!!

I wont be buying any tickets to watch. I hope for her sake 'The First Eck' will be gentle with her.

What a shambles the opposition are all round including our friends down South in the coalition.

I feel there might be a pressure on the SNP for having the referendum a wee bit earlier if the May elections do go well; due to popular demand.

Just a few hard facts from 'The First Eck' to set out our stall to the Scottish people on how much better of we would be ; even on the back of a fag packet and I'll be Ok with that.

However I suppose that common sense will prevail and a full debate will be had in due course. Roll on the referendum.
 
 
# hektorsmum 2011-12-17 17:35
Well I have documentation from the SNP, why not give them a ring I think they will send you some too.
 
 
# call me dave 2011-12-17 19:35
# hektorsmum

Hi: got mine and read it:

I was saying I believe in Independence and the SNP even if they wrote their policies on the back of a fag packet. I'm convinced but others yet have to be.

Hence the procedure.

:@)
 
 
# gopher3 2011-12-17 14:59
So Liebor still doesn't have a leader in Scotland then.????
 
 
# Louperdowg 2011-12-17 15:10
Happy days!
 
 
# daveniz 2011-12-17 15:24
johann lammont definitely has labour leader credentials after all she lies (fabricated rape case) and she usually says things with no substance ("I want a successful Scotland within the UK") - (that argument wouldnt have to be said if we were successful within the union of 300 years they have had plenty of time and how is that going to change now?) and if you ignore it just shout the same stuff louder expecting a different result!
 
 
# albafreedom 2011-12-17 15:28
dave, you pretty much summed it up....Same old ..same old. Very sad really.
 
 
# Marian 2011-12-17 15:42
Seven months taken to elect someone who will have about as much impact as a flea on an elephants back - what a waste of time and an insult to the people of Scotland and Holyrood.
 
 
# Arraniki 2011-12-17 15:51
Pace call me dave 2011-12-17 14:58

Well it's Lamont who was left with the 'old maid card' after all the shuffling in the labour pack.

Very perceptive. And wish I had said that.
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 16:30
You will! :-)
 
 
# rhymer 2011-12-17 16:23
[ Abusive comment on the basis of a person’s personal appearance removed. – NNS Mod Team ]
 
 
# Tam Glen 2011-12-17 16:23
offensive comment removed - NNS Moderation Team
 
 
# farrochie 2011-12-17 16:34
Just listened to Johann's victory speech. She seems not to have grasped that the referendum will be held in the latter half of this Parliament. She says: No policy is off-limits but she loves Scotland so much she does not want it to have all the rights of an independent country. So Independence is off-limits!
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 16:35
The intriguing thing about SLab and Westminster, is who speaks for SLab there?

Curran : Shadow SoS appointed by Miliband or Sarwar : chosen by the members (maybe, we don't have the breakdown of college votes yet)?

If there are no differences between SLab and UKLab, then the lack of meaning in the supposed new arrangements are demonstrated. If there are differences, whose mouthpiece is Curran to be?
 
 
# Tearlach 2011-12-17 16:38
Here is the link to the results

labourlist.org/.../...

Some report suggest that Ken McIntosh won the grassroots membership vote by 51% to Johanns 36% -Davidson and Lamont had hufe Union support.
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 16:56
Thanks for that - though I'd like to see the actual numbers and not just percentages. I wonder if they'll publish them?
 
 
# Clarinda 2011-12-17 17:04
Who/what are "Affiliates" that appear to have a substantial say in the election? Do the two totals which both = 100% each mean that every voter in the three eligible groups voted?
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 17:23
As I understand Labour's arcane system, "affiliates" are largely the unions, but also Fabian societies etc (whether the social club members are included, I don't know).

Regardless of how many people vote in any of the electoral colleges, each college is allocated a third of the final votes.
 
 
# Old Smokey 2011-12-17 17:05
So to place it perspective, if it had only been the 13000 card carrying members of Labour in Scotland, it would have been Ken McIntosh as theire parliamentary leader and not Lamont. Its good to see Labour continueing its democracy, nothing has changed in the last 50 years with them
 
 
# Old Smokey 2011-12-17 16:55
Hate to be cynical, but then thats what Labour are, the cynical party
Lamont for the 'wummin' vote and Sarwar for the 'asian' vote
Nice to see the BBC taking its usual slavering atitude and not being objective
 
 
# Lupus Incomitatus 2011-12-17 17:10
Meanwhile on Planet Whatever, this is what Nick Clegg had to say about Rotten Johnny Foreigner and their Xenophobia about Mother England.

uk.news.yahoo.com/.../

This is obviously playing to the Home Counties Swivel Eyed DT and D Mail readers as he manages to lump Alex Salmond into his rant, thereby feeding some more red meat to his bestial votes farm. They now include the Guardian readers.
Quote:
Mr Clegg told the Guardian newspaper: "The danger at the moment is because society is under economic stress, xenophobia, chauvinism and polarisation increase.

"You can see it in British politics. This is the perfect environment if you are (UKIP leader) Nigel Farage or (SNP leader) Alex Salmond.


Haved any the Scottish titles picked up on this barefaced cheek of equating the SNP with UKIP. All that was missing was the English Defence League in the comparison.


I wonder if Nick Clegg ran this past whatsisname Liberal in Scotland? Rennie isn't it?


Naw, he is learning his statecraft and diplomacy, on the hoof, from Camerooned.


Let's get this out into the blogosphere and knock a few more % pints off the Scottish Liberals.
 
 
# hektorsmum 2011-12-17 17:37
I too was absolutely furious with this, then I thought we have definitely got them rattled. More publicity and another nail in the Liberals coffin.
 
 
# A_Scottish_Voice 2011-12-17 17:11
This is important because everyone knows that the Labour party have a history of voting irregularities, and until they can show that they can reframe from manipulating voting systems, then the public will see them as corrupt and not fit for purpose.

Labour will never be seen as an effective opposition party trusted by the public, if the party only exists in its current form due to illegitimate voting.
 
 
# Old Smokey 2011-12-17 17:18
I'm sorry but I really cant picture Rosa Klebb on the international stage. I would imagine the Labour hierarchy dont see that either as they just want Holyrood to remain a political back water
 
 
# km 2011-12-17 17:19
I would suggest the only role to which she is electable is within the Labour Party.

She did say, "Thank you to Iain Gray for all he has done for the Party". I would like to echo those thanks.
 
 
# ianbeag 2011-12-17 17:43
300,000 votes available and only 13,000 members in Scotland - Mr Putin will be very envious of these numbers.
 
 
# call me dave 2011-12-17 18:27
Quoting ianbeag:
300,000 votes available and only 13,000 members in Scotland - Mr Putin will be very envious of these numbers.



Yes maybe it's 'buy one get one free'

Ooops!!
 
 
# Shug MacTamson 2011-12-17 19:24
I have a friend in the Labour Party who had seven, yes seven votes in the leadership election - see s1212.photobucket.com/.../... I'm in yellow, LP pal is in red and the guy in grey is an FB friend.
 
 
# cynicalHighlander 2011-12-17 19:49
Labour’s voting system: the case for reform: newstatesman.com/.../...

Quote:
As I've pointed out before, the party's tripartite electoral college (divided between MPs/MEPs, party members, and affiliated trade unions and socialist societies) means that some votes are worth significantly more than others. The vote of one MP is worth the votes of 608 party members and 12,915 affiliated members. The vote of one party member is worth the votes of 21 affiliated members.
 
 
# rai1869 2011-12-17 18:02
x-mas come early for alex and the SNP, just when you think it couldn't get worse for labour they go and put a gun to their own head, staggering
 
 
# Mark MacLachlan 2011-12-17 19:20
Ms Lamont has arrived.

twitpic.com/7ul3bg


Hat tip to Mudfries.
 
 
# mudfries 2011-12-17 21:19
Ha!Ha! brilliant mark, I swear as soon as I saw that picture the broons came into my head!
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 21:45
:D
 
 
# Macart 2011-12-17 22:24
Superb! :0D
 
 
# snowthistle 2011-12-17 19:23
Derek Mackay should get on with convening business and leave Labour to their own leadership elections. What the hell has it got to do with him?
 
 
# UpSpake 2011-12-17 19:25
Doesn't matter anymore, we have the result we always wanted. Another Labour heavyweight elected to Leadership. Game on as they say !.
 
 
# Mark MacLachlan 2011-12-17 20:13
Ok someone of a mathematical bent help me out here...

Tom Harris received 1.78% of votes from the combined 80 Labour MPs, MSPs and MEPs, we can presume that he voted for himself. Did anyone else?

labourlist.org/.../...
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 20:22
One person voted for him (presumably himself), but it means that only 56 of the SLab MPs, MSPs and MEPs actually bothered to cast a vote!

Even among the electorate consisting of elected Parliamentarian s, only 70% could be @rsed enough about the result to vote.
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 21:15
No. I got that wrong. 1.78% represents the % gained divided by 3.

75 Parliamentarian s voted, and the numbers were actually

La-Mont 40 : Macintosh 31 : Harris 4
 
 
# handclapping 2011-12-17 21:10
It is 1.78% of the total college vote but 3x that within the Parliamentary college, ie 5.333% of the 77 eligible to vote, who all seem to have voted, so of the non-commited 4 voted for Harris, 41 for Johann and 32 for the unmemorable one
 
 
# proudscot 2011-12-17 21:07
Rosa said she'll be able to handle AS no problem, as she was used to controlling a class of 15-year-olds on the last Friday afternoon before the Xmas break. I tell you what, if I'd been her class, you wouldn't have heard a peep out of me either, with THAT coupon looming menacingly over the teacher's desk up front!
 
 
# Fortitudine 2011-12-17 21:35
I was one who had the misfortune of seeing that coupon in her class. Not a pleasant experience at all! Many in my class failed our higher English so it would appear her teaching skills were as adept as her political ones ;-)
 
 
# proudscot 2011-12-18 00:45
Quoting Fortitudine:
I was one who had the misfortune of seeing that coupon in her class. Not a pleasant experience at all! Many in my class failed our higher English so it would appear her teaching skills were as adept as her political ones ;-)


Fortitudine, I think you'll find Ms Lamont failed her higher English too!
 
 
# Teri 2011-12-17 21:15
I dont think there's any doubt that multiple votes were cast. With 13,000 members and 300,000 votes cast it is clear. Johann Lamont and her husband Archie Graham, depute Leader of Glasgow City Council, would have had many votes between them alone, Johann herself probably had at least 4 votes - - one as a party member, one as and MSP, one as a Union member and one as a member of the Cooperative party. Her husband could have had a similar number of votes and if there are adult children still at home, they would have votes as well. Michty me, at this rate she and her extended family may have made it possible.
 
 
# clootie 2011-12-17 21:50
Poor Archie - he will dread Thursday nights from now on. (post FMQ the political version of PMT)
 
 
# gieusabrek 2011-12-17 23:06
Sorry to spoil the party but can someone explain why I can see a post timed at 21:50 at 21:25 (I am posting this at 21:47)
 
 
# oldnat 2011-12-17 23:09
Didn't you see the research that some neutrinos can travel faster than light?

NNS is even further ahead of the game! :-)
 
 
# Marga B 2011-12-18 00:16
Completely OT: a comment on a very silly article on British patriotism in the Guardian:

"I find starkey the most ill informed ferson on histirical facts.
We english have been poked by the Scots and we have woken up in a 21st century britain where english as a nationality doesnt exist.unlike the scots who have always held onto thiers.we have to define what it is and where we are going.especially when Scotland breaks away.Scotland showed us and the world how to be a nation and they are showing us once again."

The article itself, by an English art critic, contains this wonderful sentence:

"In the late 80s, Thatcherism became broadly accepted, and a combination of strong service and financial sectors definitively replaced our industrial heritage in the national psyche."

Before you jump to conclusions, the guy meant it.
 
 
# Caadfael 2011-12-18 10:10
Thats all you can expect from an "art critic"!
After all, he probably believes that Tracy Emin is a talented artist!!
 
 
# gus1940 2011-12-18 10:07
Labour's annihilation in May resulted in many of their 'star players' heading for the Exit Door from Holyrood.

We Know that Kerr quickly stepped into a well paid sinecure but does anybody know what has happened to the rest of that not so merry band and if any of them have struck it lucky in The Labour Jobs For The Boys (Political Rejects Section) Roundabout.
 

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