By a Newsnet reporter

The Scottish Labour party cannot be trusted and are “out of touch” according to a new poll.

Asked by pollsters YouGov to describe Johann Lamont’s party, 35% opted for “untrustworthy”, with a similar number saying they were “out of touch”.

29% said they were “incompetent” and 26% claimed Labour in Scotland were “boring”.

Only 13% of respondents described Labour in positive terms, with 5 per cent saying they were “efficient” and just 8 per cent opting for “trustworthy”.

The news will be disappointing to Johann Lamont, who replaced Iain Gray as leader after the party’s humiliation at the 2011 Scottish election.  It also comes after the party faced a split in its ranks with the setting up of a pro-independence website ‘Labour for Independence’.

The latest poll follows a series of surveys showing the SNP has built on their 2011 support levels.  It also follows surveys showing that support for independence has not been dented by the recent wall to wall media promotion of ‘Britishness’ due to the Jubilee and the Olympics.

Labour sources have denied the poll is of concern to the party and have described it as an indication of an ‘anti-politics’ mood in the nation.  

A Scottish Labour spokesman said: “We knew when we lost the Scottish Parliament elections in 2011 that people wanted us to change.  That’s why in the past year, we’ve seen real change in our party that’s helped us get closer to people and communities across the country.”

However the party north of the border will be concerned that the installation of Johann Lamont as new Scottish leader has led to huge swathes of the electorate dismissing the party.

An SNP spokesman said: “The poll is extremely bad news for Labour, and it also underlines the breadth and strength of support for the SNP government’s record, team and vision for Scotland.”


# SEUMAS31 2012-08-02 11:52
I just can't imagine a Scottish Government under the control of Johann, Jackie, and the two Richards, emigration would be the only solution.
# bringiton 2012-08-02 12:05
No policies,No aspiration,No hope,No future.
# farrochie 2012-08-02 12:17
We need party leaders who can speak up for Scotland at an international level. If Scottish party leaders always have to defer to London, they will never be able to represent Scotland's international interests.
# Jim Johnston 2012-08-02 18:45
They can't represent anyones interest for representing their own.

Inept shambles doesn't even begin to describe Labour, "Old" "New" or "Scottish".
# twinpowr 2012-08-02 12:21
"Labour sources have denied the poll is of concern to the party and have described it as an indication of an ‘anti-politics’ mood in the nation."

And they say THEY ARE NOT out of touch.

They are like Jimmy Cricket to left feet.
# IXL 2012-08-02 12:31
Scotland Needs Protection
( from incompetents like that pictured above )

Scotland Needs Peace( not involvement in illegal wars and possession of WMD )

Scotland Needs Prosperity
( not Labour-inspired profligacy and resulting indebtedness)

Scotland Needs Progress
( towards an inclusive, fairer society not back to victorian levels of disparity between rich and poor)

Alba Gu Brath
# call me dave 2012-08-02 13:33
I like your post IXL:

They are bereft of any ideas that are of benefit to the Scottish people and if they did have an idea they would have to pass it to Westminster for permission to run with it.
# IXL 2012-08-02 15:57
You are very welcome Dave :-)
# Bobelix 2012-08-02 14:43
Pinched! Good one!
# clootie 2012-08-02 12:37
My concern is that they still have the Westminster vote - Scotland deserves better and they should give Labour in Scotland a clear message at every election.

Labour will not heed the Holyrood voting if they are still getting the Westminster vote.

20 SNP seats at Westminster in 2010 would have made them sit up. However after 2014 Westminster will be of little concern.

Perhaps one day we will have a real Scottish Labour party and they will return to the original values.
# scottish_skier 2012-08-02 19:06
My concern is that they still have the Westminster vote.

Not from all the poll data I have, and that's all the poll data there is. I think.

For Westminster VI, using all other polls bar yougov Scotland, I have (Holyrood in brackets):

SNP = 43% (46%)
Lab = 33% (31%)
Con = 16% (12%)
Lib = 6% (6%)

From Yougov UK-wide I get the same thing (don't ask me how, but I do). This would deliver 60% of MPs as SNP.

The Scotland intentions now follow holyrood intentions (slightly more subdued re SNP share, but only by a few points) - happened from early 2011 onwards.

Yougov are the 'tesco value' of polls when it comes to Scotland-wide Westminster VI and Y/N to indy. It is a problem with their weighting methods. In a way you could consider that they are applying methods which work in England but not in Scotland, scotland having 2 parliaments that people vote for in different ways for different reasons, unlike England. Be careful of them unless you spend too much time following polls like me...
# oldnat 2012-08-02 19:46
As another polling geek - agreed!

I actually like much of YG's methodology on a GB level - but it simply can't cope with a different political system where people identify differently according to the political contest involved.

In Scotland only polls, YG's methodology means that they can't select their pannelists to be representative of the Scottish population.

Lallands Peat Worrier has an interesting analysis of the Fabian commissioned poll.

# scottish_skier 2012-08-03 18:34
Interesting analyses there by LPT.

Interesting that only the Westminster VI results have been published by Yougov (as far as I can see). I guess the Fabian Society, with it's links to Labour, were not overly happy with the SNP's 15 point lead for Holyrood...
# RJBH 2012-08-02 12:44
Dismal, Negative, Gordon Broonish, Yesterdayish, Sleekit, Expenses Troughish, Cronismists, Policyless, Darkness, Hopeless, Toryish, Inefficient, Bullyboyish. Glasgow Councilish, Unionist, Takes their voters for sure there are plenty more word out there to describe the party that once led Scotland into the wilderness.
# thomsor 2012-08-02 12:47
The problem for Slab as well as the Con/libs is that they are quite comfortable with the view of Scotland as a region of England and not as a country. They really have no ambition for Scotland and its people. I would not trust Labour with education fees, Council Tax, Council housing nor the NHS. I hope Lamont and co continue to bury their heads in the sand.
# Mac 2012-08-02 13:05
It would seem that what Allan Grogan, of Labour for Independence, had to say about the Labour party has a lot of validity, "There are also many supporters who once were Labour but have lost faith or moved political ideology because of a Labour party more concerned with middle England than their core bases, especially Scotland."

The words, "especially Scotland" must be ringing in Scottish Labour's ears after this poll.
# ButeHouse 2012-08-02 13:10
SEUMAS31 says: I just can't imagine a Scottish Government under the control of Johann, Jackie, and the two Richards, emigration would be the only solution......
....neither can the voters SEUMAS31 which is why the SNP lead from 2011 is growing.

Labour's problem is too many of the faithful and virtually the whole of the hierarchy actually see the PARTY as the be all and end all rather than the voters.

As far as Scotland's concerned we are just there to produce the usual crop of Labour MPs to help make a Westminster majority.

By coincidence Party First does bring many lucrative personal rewards.....know wot I mean....nudge nudge....wink wink?

VOTE YES in 2014
# Galen10 2012-08-02 13:28
SLab have long since made their decision to shackle themselves to the corpse of the nauseating New Labour project, however out of touch that makes them with ordinary Scottish voters and Labour members/activists.

Just as the defeat in the 2010 Westminster GE taught the UK party nothing, the 2011 result in Scotland taught the Scottish party nothing. We are still waiting to see the staked corpse of New Labour.... show us the body!

If Scottish Labour, and the second raters leading it, had had any gumption they would have taken the "Bavarian" option and set themselves up as a seperate party; that might conceivably have saved them, and made it easy for them to differentiate themselves from the ConDems and act as the standard bearer for Devo-max or FFA.

Their abject failure to pitch their tents squarely on the progressive, left of centre territory that was and is most likely to appeal to the Scottish electorate has handed a gift to the SNP.

If the result in 2014 is YES, that result will in large part be attributable to the lack of imagination of both the UK and Scottish Labour establishments, and their failure to exorcise the ghost of New Labour.

Even if the result in 2014 is no however, I see little future for SLab. They will prove unable to make good on their promises of "more" devolution, and don't have the people or the political will to put the genie back in the bottle.

So much for devolution killing independence stone dead eh?
# GrassyKnollington 2012-08-02 13:43
The Scottish Labour party cannot be trusted and are “out of touch” according to a new poll.

They most certainly can't be trusted.

They've led Scots to believe that there is a Scottish Labour party for starters when no such beastie exists.

A tacit understanding amongst our tame British nationalist media that there is a Scottish Labour Party simply because they call it that should be challenged at every turn.

The leader of Scottish Labour is Nick Park's plasticine man, Ed Milliband.

The rumour that our Johann was promoted to top dog of the fictional Scottish party and indeed all Labour MP's in Scotland was never supported by a shred of evidence that I've seen.

Maybe they should create a Scottish Labour Party before we decide if we can trust them.

The fact that the dull branch managers and time servers controlled by UK Labour and parroting whatever they're told can't be trusted in Scotland is surely a given.
# Robabody 2012-08-02 16:51
on the money as usual GK!
# Training Day 2012-08-02 14:02
Watching at first hand, as I did, the ranks of aspiring Labour politicians graduate through the National Union of Students or via bag-carrying for now Labour Lords a-leaping was a truly depressing experience. What characterised them, without exception, was an inability to be associated with any form of belief, credo, conviction or idea. Careerism was everything, the Labour party merely a vehicle for the self-aggrandisement of the vacuous, the bland and the uninspiring.

Small wonder, then, that increasing numbers of Scots are seeing them for the wretched, amoral placemen and women that they most assuredly are.
# clochoderic 2012-08-02 19:47
Spot on, TD.
An outstanding example of the breed must surely be Wee Doogie Alexander.
Parachuted into a safe SLAB seat (my contituency) in 1997 he has done nothing of note in the intervening years except, perhaps, keep one foot in each of the Blairite and Broonite camps.
His failures are many however - the fiasco of the spoiled ballot in 2007 and his inept handling of Broon's bottled election of the same year spring to mind.
Yet this lightweight, pipsqueak speak-your-weight machine is regularly referred tp as some kind
Of "heavyweight" by the press.
Can anyone, anywhere actually name one memorable thing he has ever done or said in his entire, lucrative "career"?
# xyz 2012-08-02 14:24
Well worth a read if you have not already:

" Johann Lamont once again trots out the line that the independence referendum doesn’t offer Scotland its only realistic chance of escaping Tory government for the forseeable future. Once again, the Labour quasi-leader insisted that the choice between independence and the Tories was a false one, and that her party provided a genuine ideological alternative to the right-wing neoliberal philosophy which has dominated UK politics since 1979.

Unfortunately, that’s a lie. "
# Diabloandco 2012-08-02 15:25
OT but could I put in a plea to all who respond to Alan Cochranes puerile piffle -DON'T.
Leave the site to the appalling Westheadbanger and his equally pathetic cohorts.
I hate to think of mega bucks being earned by the kind of spiteful ,inaccurate $h^te which that moron writes.
# bringiton 2012-08-02 18:26
The Torygraph and it's sister paper,the Scotsman have a very limited readership in Scotland so to quote Doings R Us "who cares ?"
# Leswil 2012-08-02 16:50
Lamont thinks her new jokingly abrasive way of talking at FMQ's is helping her image, her spin doctors seem to like it and must be encouraging it.

However, they don't get it, she acts like she wants to be a stand in for the Krankies!, that is the part people see funny.

Not that she can see it, so what does that tell you about her intellect as far as real politics are concerned?

Labour itself however is far from a joke, doing Scotland down, having an acknowledged agenda of disagreeing on anything the SG suggests, no matter of what value it is to the people of Scotland.

labour has done a huge amount of damage in Scotland while hugging the Unionist ethos.

Labour UK needs Scotland but takes the votes here as almost a right, no matter what the outcome for us, the Union is their want.

To keep us shackled, to deprive voters of real progress because that is something they do not want us to have.

Finally I do believe that labour voters are wakening up to this, and not before time.
# Robabody 2012-08-02 22:09
Stop, Stop Lw for the love of goodness. We've got Ruth (action Krankie) already without inflicting the vision of Johann (red Tory) Krankie on us. Yuk.
In all other respects of your article, I tend to agree.
PS I recall that some elements of labour thought she was out of the "bonny fechter" mould when she was anointed, not that I agree. The classroom oik, writ large, springs to mind.

Untrustworthy - the whole shebang - you bet.
# JRTomlin 2012-08-02 18:29
I wish you would LINK to poll results.
# oldnat 2012-08-02 20:25
If you haven't seen them elsewhere -
# Early Ball 2012-08-02 18:51
Interesting tweet from Labour MP to Jim Murphy (did he ever apologise for his Hampden gaffe?).

Austin was replying to Murphy who said on the subject of the GB women cyclists getting disqualified that the last time he was so disappointed was election night 2010.

Ian Austin ‏@IanAustinMP
@jimmurphymp No, to be honest. Did think about that but we knew we were going to lose months/years before so it wasn't a shock like this
Reply Retweet Favorite

I thought they were gobsmacked on election night apart from Stairheid who was unusually chirpy.
# Davy 2012-08-02 20:01
When Labours "Ed Milliband" agreed to back David Cameron and the torys 100% to keep the union, you would have thought that labour supporters in Scotland would have been up in arms. But no instead they happyly followed the path that westminster laid down for them, they are complacent to everything that london says and have no ambition to stand up for either themselves or their country.

Untrustworthy = Labour.

Out of touch = Labour.

In denial = Labour.

Labour in Scotland = tory.
# Fungus 2012-08-02 22:18
Aren't you all being a wee bit unfair here? So a poll says people think Labour are untrustworthy...who believes polls? I think they are the best thing for Scotland since sliced bread, I mean look how the incisive wit and debating prowess of Johann Lamont has Alex Salmond reeling against the ropes at every FMQ. And I'm not the only one to notice this, Brian Taylor remarks on it every week.
No Labour is far from done under the leadership of Ms Lamont and if you are reading this Johann, don't change a thing, just keep right on doing what you are doing. That way Scotland will get the result she deserves come the referendum.
# A Ship Called Dignity 2012-08-02 22:19
Watching the tweets from some of the Scottish Labour MP's re the Olympic Team GB victories and the jibes. Then a thought came over me. It's not the Shipyard workers and others highlighted by the aforementioned who need to look forward to the dole, it's them. Now we see were the visceral attitude comes from. Their MSP's are tame in comparison. Of course they will have a job post 2014. Of course Foulkes and friends are going the same way. Can't come soon enough.
# cjmasta 2012-08-02 23:54
Unionism at all costs to Scotland lays at the heart of Labour, i`m too young to remember otherwise. I keep hearing of this once great party of the people but it really is hard to imagine in this present time. We could take baby steps with labour towards a Scotland which most want NOW and not get there for years or go with the present Scottish Government and take one giant leap and take full responsibility. Progress in moving the country forward or more of the same old cap in hand begging westminster and having to explain why we want the powers needed to better ourselves only for them to fall on deaf ears, or should I say unsympathetic ears. They see every power devolved as another nail in the coffin of their control, totally at odds of course with common sense how we wish to better the lives of those we cherish most.
# Macart 2012-08-03 03:20
Just google Keir Hardie or Jimmy Reid to see where Labour should be. The Labour movement and the principles it was founded upon aren't in themselves the enemy. The people who lead this movement, the politicians, are the problem. Labour voters, even Labour members are just folks like you and me wanting to get by and hoping and praying that their representatives stand for them and beside them.

Somewhere along the line it changed from representing people's interests to representing party interests.
# Desperate Dora 2012-08-03 08:58
Somewhere along the line it changed from representing people's interests to representing party interests.

Well said, Macart. This really is at the heart of the problem and why I have to admire the new Labour for Independence movement - at last, Labour supporters who put the interests of the people and the country before the interests of the party.
# davemsc 2012-08-03 12:19
So it's an indication of the 'anti-politics mood', just like their two Scottish parliamentary election losses were because "The Scottish people stopped listening to us" (Lamont's on words). They say that people expected them to change, but they haven't. It's the same old Labour complacency and arrogance. They aren't wrong - everyone else is. Their leader is a joke, their health spokesperson is a fantasist, and their chosen head of the No campaign is in denial about his own failures. 'Scottish' Labour: The party of utter delusion and hypocrisy.
# GrassyKnollington 2012-08-03 15:26
Yep even their claim to be Scotland's largest Party is looking as real as rocking horse ordure and Rev Stu observes today there seems to be nothing to stop them making up any old stuff they like.
# karaokeguitarman 2012-08-04 14:37
Voting intention at Holyrood is higher than at Westminster, which is higher than support for independence currently( or is it)? Clearly Scots recognise that the SNP are efficient in government,but many still see SLABOUR as a party who will stop the TORIES, when in fact the opposite is true.Thats how they get elected into Scotland.Increased support for an SNP government was always going to precede a majority for independence.
Its a bit like a bus journey INDEPENDENCE STREET via Devolution Avenue.We call at a few stops. some people climb aboard, whilst a few may alight.The bus will reach its destination, although the route may be subject to a diversion or two.The bus has momentum and its downhill now.It wont be stopped now, delayed possibly, but it will carry on anyway irrespective of what power we have.
All this means is we are on our way, but the fat lady is just rehearsing. She will bring the house down soon however.Every day sees a slight rise in SNP membership, and Labour have no leadership material in either parliament.Once the people understand that vote Labour = vote LibDem = vote TORY they will waken up to reality.You did not oppose the Tories.You left the back door open, invited burglars into the house, made them a cup of tea and helped them load up the getaway van !Next time vote SCOTLANDS Party.Its where you live after all !

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